With both the Leupold and the Aimpoint, fir- ing off the bench produced pretty good groups of 312 to four inches with the Black Hills and Hornady ammo. Certainly seems to be the case - though some folks still swear they're getting crazy good groupings with the M1A. Learn all the important stuff about handgunswith none of the attitude. I later purchased a relatively inexpensive scout long eye relief scope from UTG. I know this differs from gun to gun because of all the odd mechanical claptrap which also differs from gun to gun. If you shoot nothing but pistol grips, you might find the old stock hard to handle. Just wanted some feedback from people that One shoot we went to 800, but my slow load with a 60 grain V-max was key holing at 800. Honestly I couldn't read all of this, but what I did seems like a lot of operator error. But with the M1A SOCOM 6 CQB, they are. Adjustment graduations on the rear sight drum are 1 MOA for both windage and elevation. Winchester's PDX1 Defender 120-gr. WebThe .458 SOCOM achieves optimum ballistic performance in barrel lengths shorter than 16 so there is no need for longer, less portable barrels. I really hope you guys keep making those in the format you used, it was perfect. There are probably at least eight maybe 10 calibers that may outperform a 308 none of them are very interesting to me and I really don't like hearing about all the new stuff. They were all accuracy problems, every stinking one. The M14 is no different. It passed its bench checks with flying colors and went on to perform admirably at the shooting range. Unfortunately, we still werent getting great results, and the forward-mounted Picatinny rail on the SOC16 means that youre essentially relegated to scout scopes with good eye relief. The fit and finish are great. Right side of Springfield Armory SOCOM 16 CQB wearing Flat Dark Earth stock. If the experience with the M1As is really in your head. Probably an anomaly in your case . The only thing I agree is backwards about the rifle is the exposed rod which can catch on things and cause malfunctions, and forces you to be careful where you hold the weapon. Loaded with features from top to bottom, the XD-S Mod.2 is a slim single stack pistol perfect for concealed carry. However, the sling mount kinda gets in the way of what, for me, feels like a natural hand placement and youve got to keep your fingers away from the op-rod all the same. .308 WIN MSRP $1,942 - $2,087 What sticks out as extremely odd for me personally though, is that weve never experienced issues quite like this with any of our other .308 guns, and the issues occurred across multiple reasonably experienced shooters. The SOCOM 16 is most certainly an effective weapon, but its also a fun weapon. which was 94 percent of list velocity. There are a ton of aftermarket accessories available for the M1A, such as radically different chassis that update its design ergonomics to something that feels much more modern if you cant stand the old-school vibe. I witnessed a live-fire demonstration of this load fired into calibrated 10 percent ballistic gelatin. One day I happened to notice that the rear sight assembly was loose somehow. The unit had three sections: a competitive pistol section, of which I was a member; a competitive rifle section; and a counter sniper (CS) training section. Considering the fact that it was 100+ degrees on our shoot day and firing a shitton of .308 on guns with meat tenderizers on their buttplates isnt the most pleasant thing in the world, we resigned ourselves to chill on the M1As and take them to a local range to shoot groups and get them dialed in. After some internet research I determine that the rear sight spring was not fitted properly. This was just my personal experience and 2 cents. Inconsistent cheek weld and sight picture is the usual problem with the kind of shot groups you were showing. This was a 100 meter range so it was a little over 100 yards and, in all fairness, I had done some competitive shooting but only in small bore. Interesting though, I've had a c308 laying around my closet for 2 years and really didn't like it even though I hadn't fired it. I think it balances a bit better, and I liked the sights on the Scout much better than the Socom. Lightweight and agile rifle solutions that come packed with enhanced components selected for rugged durability. The guns also got a 5lb two-stage trigger, which might feel sort of heavy, but its really obvious when its going to break and theres very minimal creep on the takeup. Rifle in a high ready OR (you won't believe this) tucking the stock under the arm pit to shorten the rifle immensely. Ask my wife! I am a skinny guy and I found out that a 308 rocks me back some. The M1As 58 with Match barrels, excellent triggers and glass-bedded wood stocks. Oops, there's been an error. Aimpoint T2 Micro; Trijicon RMR; wars in Iraq and Afghanistan opened a need for a military rifle that could engage targets at ranges far outside the M-16/M-4s maximum effective range. The 16.25" barrel of the M1A SOCOM 16 features a 1:11" six-groove right-hand twist to maximize accuracy while minimizing bulk and weight. .308 WIN MSRP $2,087 - $2,540 M1A Scout Squad Rifles Combining the legendary power and accuracy of the M1A with the quick handling and fast sight acquisition of a scout style rifle. The AR-type 5-postion adjustable shoulder stock is fitted with a removable rubber recoil pad and cheek riser. Here, we were able to get into the mechanical functioning and design of the gun and how to turn the plain vanilla M14 into an extremely ac- curate match-grade rifle. Hes a former paratrooper/small arms tech with the 82nd Airborne Division, former member of the Army Marksmanship Unit, and earned the Distinguished Pistol Shot Badge, the NRA 2600 Club, and Presidents Hundred tab. They are most definitely not like the AR-15's of today. Even the lightest .458 SOCOM round is more than three times heavier than the M855 round. Shooting nato surplus lately, malaysian mainly, some austrian in the que. Try adjusting your selection. guns & The National Match didnt much like PRVI 145, but did okay with with PRVI 180, because literally nothing about any of this makes sense. But now at least I have a rifle that shoots. To achieve this it is best to start by getting acquainted with a shooting sling and building a rock solid prone position. The Scout, on the other hand, has an even shorter barrel and an effective range of only 300 yards. you a link to reset your password. The latest content straight to your inbox plus an automatic entry to each of our monthly gungiveaways! The muzzle of the 16.25" medium-profile carbon-steel barrel is fitted with a slim multi-port brake that brings the total barrel length to just under 18". ABM ammo shot best groups of the day at 100 yards with Aimpoint installed. with Empty Magazine & OpticCapacity: 10-Round Parkerized Steel Removable Box MagazineTwist: 1:11 RHRifle Grooves: 6Accessories: One Magazine, Soft Carry Case, Owner's ManualMSRP: $2420. This multi-function case features multiple pouches for range books, ammo, cleaning kits, spotting scope, and other gear. Re: AR15 16" maximum effective range A 16" AR can get you to 1K with a 1:8 or 1:7 twist barrel with the 75+ grain bullets (maybe 68 grain BTHP). Look at slow motion videos of an AK-47 vs an AR-15. The vaunted mid 20th century designed AR15 is over 60 years old, and only 25 years younger than the "antique" Garand design. Sorry, no products match that criteria. The AK looks like a wave of motion. The primary complaints were fragile receivers, malformed bolts, poor accuracy, and instability during automatic fire. Incentive is the key. These days there are a lot of options for compact 7.62 NATO guns. First, she likes to eat only certain kinds of ammo. I shot 243 on qual day 49 from the 500 Meter line. Thanks again. Early M1A rifles were built with surplus G.I. features amazing power in a close quarters-sized package. The results you were getting were similar to mine, but a bit worse. You just found a new world to explore and its a little unnerving. and measures 37.25 in overall length. The Aimpoint was still effective engaging the target at that extended range. I was an across the course NRA high power service rifle shooter for many years and I took the Match M1A out to 600 yards shooting with iron sights and it was great! 460 meters/500 yards here. Shooting iron sights I had no issues getting tight shot groups at both 100 and 200 yards. NO. I have some time on long range shooting, Im accomplished at about a half mile, but even the national match failed me at what I would expect at 100 yards, for $2,500+ it should shoot sub moa, I couldnt get below 2 moa. Nothing that involved extensive gunsmithing or modifications. I have found that the M1A likes you to be vary consistent. I've been shooting M1A's since the early 90's. This was the last original Springfield design. I had both the Scout and the Socom 16, and I liked the Scout better, so I kept it. WebThe Springfield Armory M1A is a semi-automatic rifle made by Springfield Armory, Inc., beginning in 1971, based on the M14 rifle, for the civilian and law enforcement markets in the United States. That said, there has also been quite a bit of chamber variation over the years which necessitates handloading brass which has been fire formed to a specific chamber and carefully checked for case stretching to obtain top accuracy. But I have experienced the same thing as you have, are beautiful rifles and sexy as hell just not something I need around my house. My love affair with a 308 as lasted my lifetime. Sad to hear that they suffer from lack of quality product now days. Once worked in, the safety is quick and easy to disengage by simply pushing your trigger finger forward without losing your grip on the rifle, then have your finger ready for firing. I have owned the National Match, Standard and Socom versions of the M1A, I had all the same issues, they are extremely finnicky with optics and mounts. I have a standard m1a and love it. I qualified expert with the M14 in 66 with targets from 50 to 400 yards. Proposition 65 became law in November 1986, when California voters approved it by a 63-37 percent margin. have shot 98/100 in NRA Match prone with it. In short, I think the M14 is one of the most iconic battle rifles ever. The SOCOM 16 is most certainly an effective weapon, but its also a fun weapon. I've had an M1A for about 11 years now and had zero problems with achieving acceptable levels of accuracy that are comparable to other rifles that I own. My loaded M1a shoots sub MOA @ 100 yards & has since 1998 when I purchased it. WebSpringfield Armory M1A SOCOM 16 Accuracy Test. The match-grade tuned two-stage trigger breaks like glass at between 5 and 6 lbs. You could fully load an M-4 style rifle with 30 rounds, optic, sling, and laser and be close to that same weight. The M1A/M-14 platform is a ornery, grumpy, and non-linear rifle. Not long ago I spent some quality time on the range with Springfield's long-range Loaded M1A target model. He references head position. You could fully load an M-4 style rifle with 30 rounds, optic, sling, and laser and be close to that same weight. I eventually started using a bipod. For example, the SOCOM's barrel has been shortened to 16.25 inches, the minimum length allowed under federal law. Most of the stuff I did was learned from Youtube videos and the M14 Forum online. My accuracy comparison is to a 30-30 lever gun and an sks both with iron sights at 100yds. 7.62 NATO power in a package this small was previously unthinkable, but this ultra-modern rifle will have you believing the extraordinary. I purchased a SOCOM 16 in 2010 and my first outing with it, I found the sights hardly needed to be adjusted. Other stock colors are OD Green and Black. And for slinging shit, I would not have traded my "smoke pole" for a dozen M16s (which due to that damned recoil spring in the stock, I always thought it should have had "Mattel" stamped on the receiver. Great rifle, just takes skill and practice to know how to shoot them. Could it really be us? That's disappointing. The only complaint I have with the M1A is that I agree with you that the safety is very stiff and can be somewhat counter-intuitive, particularly if you have trained in CQB/MOUT shooting where you need to rapidly go from safe-to fire-to safe again. I don't remember the number of rounds fired for qualification but I'd fulfilled all my points before I was half way through so the rest was gravy. Again, were not so arrogant as to think that this isnt our fault but if so, why / how were we putting 2 rounds through the same hole only to completely fuck up the next round by several inches? Aimpoint T2 Micro; Trijicon RMR; wars in Iraq and Afghanistan opened a need for a military rifle that could engage targets at ranges far outside the M-16/M-4s maximum effective range. on the GI length barrel, can be used as a crude, but effective range finder. You must have JavaScript enabled in your browser to use this website. Both Army and Navy latched onto those platforms big time, although you can still see pictures in the aughts of super high-speed dudes over in O.I.F. One can argue about value of a safety that is separate from the selector switch, one can leave a weapon on full automatic without having to fumble through, you can get your weapon on safety without having to push through two selections. Caldwell Lead Sled at 100 Yards! The muzzle brake works effectively to reduce muzzle rise, keeping the gun level and on target. BUT it takes skill to achieve results using iron sights. Firing the rifle off the bench was pleasant with all ammo, despite the additional blast of the muzzle brake and not having the assist of a cheek rest. The M14 I shot in service compared to the m1a I purchased are two totally different dogs but they both like 162 and 168 grain bullets. The looks are seconds to none. With its medium-weight National Match barrel and adjustable stock, that rifle can really reach out to far-off targets. articles and videos are considered to be suggestions and not recommendations from Springfield Armory. Best to use the sadlak gas block wrench, and first time around, I had to use an extension on it. I bought an M-14 from Springfield in the late 1980's. The third option is to use the 4" long Picatinny compatible rail located in front of the action to mount a scout scope with extended eye relief. So if youre looking for a longer-ranged option, the Socom is the better All rights reserved. Rifle has a Burris 2x pistol scope . Ive seen more bad reviews than good on socom 16 version. The M1A SOCOM 16 CQB starts with a 16.25-inch, carbon-steel barrel with six-groove, 1-in-11-inch-twist rifling and a Parkerized finish. I own an M1A Scout and had a totally different experience. Its best single group was 2.05" with an average of 2.18". anything extra and your Stocks are also available in Black, OD Green and MultiCam. The SOCOM 16 is most certainly an effective weapon, but its also a fun weapon. I would have to find the reticle or dot, depending on the optic I was using. The rifle was shipped wearing the MultiCam stock, but another stock in Flat Dark Earth was included in the box. 's emerged in Afghanistan in the early/mid aughts, a whole lot of M-14's were pulled from storage, accurized/updated by independent civilian contractors, and sent along with units so that they could engage targets ~600-800 yards out (with new scopes and cheek pieces). He was born in 1921 and later served as a navy corpsman in Japan and Korea. The one you tested was a 1-11.25 twist however, few of these do a good job of stabilizing bullets much heavier than 165gr. I plan on really putting this to the test in later reviews, removing the Vortex and trying different red dots on the forward mount, and also using a Burris Scout 2-732 and some match ammo. One is a the first SOCOM that came out with the 1913 rails it was just to heavy to shoot with the rails on the front end. This was a great review. Not bad for a gas rifle with a servicegrade barrel and the Leupold scope set at 2X. Sure. My opinion is that it is a difficult toy to achieve its maximum accuracy. Proposition 65 also prohibits California businesses from knowingly discharging significant amounts of listed chemicals into sources of drinking water. Great article. The M14, in theory, would simplify the makeup of the weapons fielded by the standard American infantry squad. The how too is, engage the stock with the same amount of facial surface area and the same pressure every time. 460 meters/500 yards here. My M1A match rifle has a Springfield Armory Inc. cast receiver and a Kreiger heavy barrel mounted in a SA heavy stock. The M16As effective range is only about 400 yards. After a few mags, we decided to setup a shooting mat and rest to take some prone shots with an optic mounted to the SOC16s scout mount to see if the irons themselves were just inexplicably way off. I just find it interesting and completely different from my experience with this rifle. In our opinion the .458 SOCOM has several design and performance advantages over the.450 Bushmaster and the .500 Beowulf including improved functional reliability and the use of a standard AR magazine. The combat-proven rear sight on the M1A SOCOM 16 easily adjusts for both windage and elevation with nothing more than a standard set of human fingers. Re: AR15 16" maximum effective range A 16" AR can get you to 1K with a 1:8 or 1:7 twist barrel with the 75+ grain bullets (maybe 68 grain BTHP). For this review, I ran the rifle exclusively with the excellent Vortex red-dot optic. We hands-on review two Springfield M1As with some quirks along the way. The carbon steel barrel has a 1:11 right-hand twist, with the proprietary muzzle brake adding another 112 inch- es or so. Also, and this surprised me more than anything you wrotewhyWHY would anyone want to disengage the safety WITHOUT putting their finger near the trigger? Had same issues as your video. I myself feel the M1A is a great rifle. Suffice to say she can be very accurate when she's treated as she demands. Switching out targets from the Q target to the B17 and moving out to 300 yards was also fun. But the SOCOM I can hit what i shoot at with iron sights, now I have a trick I do. It ain't the best rifle, but it sure isn't outdated or the worst. I have trouble shooting off a bench with it. The answer is most likely in the middle - there are both poor and fantastic performing M1As in circulation for various reasons - perhaps quality control. I grew up shooting M1's. It feels good in the hands with the adjustable stock and pistol grip. The M1As safety is located within the trigger guard itself, and is essentially a metal tab that you press forward to disengage. The excellent Nightforce Optics 60x scope spotted all the shots. Snipers in ww2 had even lower standards. When I was growing up the FN FAL was the dream rifle of everyone but now they are just a fading memory. Standard Pistol Calibers. The Springfield Armory M1A SOCOM 16, like the M14, is a magazine-fed, rotating-bolt, gas-operated, air-cooled, semi-automatic, shoulder-fired rifle chambered in .308, aka 7.62x51mm NATO. We still arent quite sure what to make of this entire experience, in all honesty. I also had a lot of FTEs using Federal Match ammo. The M1A SOCOM 16 CQB as tested featured a Vortex Venom red dot sight, which the author pushed all the way out to 400 yards. I found the CQB very enjoyable to shoot from the bench, standing or walking in the woods. Now you should do a head to head comparison of both the Springfield Armory M1A and the DSA made FAL. One of the weirdest parts of the entire experience was the tendency for both guns to pull off consecutive rounds either through the same hole or touching one another, only for the next round to be a complete flier somewhere else on the paper. Why, with an ensuing internet argument, of course! Antiqued design? Their customer service was excellent, but I still have my doubts about the rifle. The traditional steel bow two-stage trigger was smooth with a 5 lbs. Fast forward to range trip number 3, and close to 900 rounds of .308 later aaaaaaaaaaaaaaand we were finally able to get some usable numbers out of these guns! Velocity is the average of five shots, measured by a Labradar chrono, programmed to measure velocity 15 feet from the muzzle. The most iconic battle rifle in American history. Not to mention noone our age at least ( I'm a 60 model) had the $ for one of those things, not when you could buy a 69 340 Barracuda for $800! It's not uncommon to see .308s with barrels from 18" to 22" long, so I broke out the trusty Lab Radar chronograph to see how much velocity the relatively short 16.25" barrel would preserve. Also, as designed by the military the gas system was only designed to handle 147 grain projectile with fast burning powders.. Thanks! It is very likely your shooter not being familiar with the weapon system that got you the results that you achieved. to PPU. Live The Armory Life. The SAINT offers upgraded features where they matter most. (Lucky bastids) As a kid from Texas this was a day doing one of my favorite things with a new rifle thrown in to boot. Steve Sieberts has over 40 years in the firearms field. I had been interested in the SOCOM version, but decided against it due to the shorter barrel length (16 inch) being a little more inefficient with the .308 WIN cartridge. Not challenging your experience with and observations of the rifle. The SOCOM 16 weighs approximately 8.8 lbs. One shoot we went to 800, but my slow load with a 60 grain V-max was key holing at 800. parts until Springfield Armory, Inc. began As time moved on, the market became more and more interested in smaller, lighter and more compact firearms. The USMC shot 500 yd targets with iron sights. Combining the performance of a larger handgun with class-leading concealability and capacity. A variety of loads are available in the 250 to 600-grain range. But it would have to come from Canada. That is something to consider when Why have the safety where you have to move the safety off before finding the trigger? Fusion soft points, designed for modern sporting rifle platforms, tripped along an 2732 fps. Then branch out to shooting over other objects. The official name of Proposition 65 is the Safe Drinking Water and Toxic Enforcement Act of 1986. The feel is amazing. I still own that rifle plus a SA that I bought from Elmer Ballance and another that was purchased from Smith Ent. Totally different way of handling the M-14/M1A platform (DuckDuckGo / G*^%&e Sage Stocks and you will see what I mean). I shoot 2- 16" AR's for competition, and they work fine to 600. So, lets take a look and compare it to my M1A Loaded Precision with an Archangel stock and optic. The radioactive Tritium front sight from XS Sights keeps the M1A SOCOM 16 on target even in dim light. WebThe SOCOM 16 put three shots into about two inches, with the other two shots opening the group up to about ten inches using the Hornady Steel Match ammo. I fired expert in basic training at Ft. 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